Summary
Former CIA Director Leon Panetta warned that Trump’s return to the White House could embolden Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, giving him a “blank check” in the Middle East and increasing the risk of war with Iran.
Panetta expressed concern that Trump would support Netanyahu’s aggressive stance against Iran without restraint, potentially worsening regional instability.
Panetta also predicted Trump might allow Russia to retain parts of Ukraine if he returns to office, though he doubted Trump’s negotiation skills.
He criticized Trump’s approach to foreign policy, suggesting Trump would be inclined to “capitulate” to authoritarian leaders, which may not sit well with some Republicans.
But thank God we saved Palestine from the evil black lady right? /s
“We stood up for our PRINCIPLES!!!”
– screamed over the sound of brown people being exterminated
Oh don’t worry, the Israelis will only murder the Palestinians that can’t get out of the West Bank and Gaza when Israel takes it over.
Iran can defend itself. Homeless children can’t.
Thank your god Netanyahu that she played into his hands.
Good thing your party stuck to their guns and didn’t compromise on committing genocide. Then you wouldn’t be able to be smug about losing to a convicted rapist and felon.
Kamela actually talked about a ceasefire several times, Trump just wanted to nuke Palestine and be done with it. If you paid attention, you’d know that.
Biden has talked about ceasefires for a year now, and proven it’s just talk. Israel has crossed so many red lines it’s impossible to keep count, all with no consequences. Harris said she wouldn’t change a thing and her campaign made sure people knew she didn’t support an arms embargo on Israel. You can gaslight yourself all you want about her intentions, but her actual words -promised- more of the same.
Trump is awful, but telling people the Dems presented any meaningful opposition to ethnic cleansing or that Harris made it clear she’d be better is propagating a convenient lie.
You might find out soon what genocide actually looks like and then you can wipe those fake tears with your useless virtue signalling. Clown
Haha genocide is not some kind of spectrum, it’s the most horrific crime a person can commit. So no, I won’t. SeE ReAl GeNOciDe. I’M ALREADY SEEING IT. All from a party that thinks I’m stupid enough to believe they’re for justice and peace
So outside of Dems learning a lesson which is now yesterdays news. Do you believe Palestinians are in a better place now Trumps is taking over?
I didn’t vote for Trump either. And it’s the Dems that blocked progressive candidates like Bernie from office.
Do you think by telling voters like me to eat shit about Gaza that they’re better off than if they had actually intervened in Israel’s genocide?
No but it’s about end results and being savvy about applying what little influence you have and thinking a step ahead. Palestinians are going to be worse off now, Trump has stated before the election that Israel can do what it wants to get the job done. How do you think Trump would handle any ongoing protests at the university’s, etc. A man just itching to deploy troops to shoot protestors.
You can blame the dems all you like but voting 3rd party or staying at home has assisted Trump back into power and brought in the loons with him that think war in the middle east will bring the rapture.
He’s going to make American, Ukrainian and Palestinian lives far worse. But yeah I guess the dem leadership has learned a lesson now they are going back to their comfortable lives that most likely won’t be impacted by any of this.
At least under the Dems you could have continued the protests, continued the pressure for peace.
If you compromise on genocide then you are not a political agent, you’re a sheep that can be herded with enough pressure.
You keep using that triangulation bullshit because your party has been using it to goad their own base into voting for far right policies OE absolutely pathetic band aids.
We’re not falling for it anymore and we’re going to fight against genocide without your worthless party.
What is fucked is that no matter what happens. They will insist that it was all the Democrat’s fault and all the fault of communists and socialists. They will be believed both despite the absurdity of it all and because of the absurdity of it.
in reality it was the 20 million voters that abstained from voting this election.
They literally stood off to the side and allowed in the man who will facilitate the complete annihilation of Palestine, so in truth they really never gave a shit about Palestinians, it was all bullshit. With Harris you at least had someone reacted to criticism and you could work with but Trump doesn’t give a single fuck about criticism or what people want
Have you seen pictures of gaza? It has been completely annihilated by Biden and Harris who finished the job that Trump talked about.
Oh Harris is the president of Israel now? Odd
She’s helping send money and weapons so she may as well be the PM
Americans live in a whole other planet
Without US money and weapons, Israel would not have been able to destroy Gaza like it has.
Yeah, that happened. Now suck it up and get ready for the fight. Who’s to blame doesn’t matter. Be prepared to fight for your life, or just shut the fuck up about it.
I’m not American, I’m just watching you idiots burn and I’m glad it’s gonna hurt, I just wish it hurt only you idiots, not the rest of the world. And please don’t move to our cuvettes, stay there and deal with your own mess, don’t come here and fuck up our country too
I like how you flipped the script by blaming the group (the voters) and not the individual responsible (the DNC) for making the horrible decisions resulting in an ongoing genocide.
The voter voted in a guy that attempted an insurrection, so yup I think they hold some responsibility here.
And what useful action does this information enable us to take? Next election, should we nominate better voters?
We have the voters we have. We need Democrats that can reach those voters. Blaming them wins us nothing.
Prepare for the likeliness that there won’t be another election. Whining about it and blaming people solves nothing. Organize your community, and prepare for the worst. It’s time to refocus.
Organize my community to do what? Refocus on what? Revolution?
Until the next election is cancelled, I plan on trying to win it. That means understanding how the Democrats failed.
Good luck with that. Organize for defense. Buy a gun, take some defense classes. Meet other lefties with guns.
“If I win, you’ll never have to vote again,” he says as if voting is a burden.
Being real for a moment, the way that the next election cycle begins immediately once the previous one ends is a bit of a burden. I’m already tired of hearing about ‘Decision 2028’.
Go on then chap, layout what that looks like with the voter we have.
It’s not like progressives haven’t been shouting the answer to this for the past 20 years, but here it is again from an apparently recent convert from within the Democratic establishment camp.
Voters to Elites: Do You See Me Now?
What it doesn’t look like is campaigning with Liz Cheney. It doesn’t look like sending Bill Clinton to Michigan to lecture Muslims on how important it is to fund Israel’s genocide. It doesn’t look like Biden’s garbage gaff. It sure as hell doesn’t look like Harris having no answer to the question of how she would break with the Biden administration. All of these failures might have been irrelevant were it not for 50 years of Democrats looking down their nose at working Americans. A lot of it is policy, but a lot is just a failure of messaging.
That wasn’t my question. It’s obvious what they did went wrong by the result. What should it look like next time?
This comment is terrible for a boatload of reasons but one of the funnier ones is that you’re talking about shifting blame from a group to an individual and then name two groups (last I checked the DNC isn’t one person).
Im sure if you think on it you’ll eventually figure it out.
This was not the election for a protest. This election was to protect democracy from a traitorois Nazi. Anyone who didn’t voters a protest is a sympathizer.
This was not the election for a protest.
It never is. Democrats keep taking advantage of that. It finally failed.
I voted for Harris.
Removed by mod
And now they’ll never get to vote agajn.
So you’re admitting that you just vote for whoever you were told to vote for?
You just follow along and do whatever the crowd does?
You’re admitting that you don’t have the mental capacity to identify the threat toward democracy and make the decision to vote for a candidate that isn’t a direct threat to global stability?
Let me explain it in a way that a simple-minded individual could understand.
Votes, elect candidates. Votes are given by voters, not political parties.
These arguments are so straw man that they give me hay fever.
Voting is done. Do something to protect your community. Organize a defense or stfu about it.
Removed by mod
The left has been warning you nonstop for the past year that this would happen. Democrats didn’t listen and instead decided that genocide and Cheneys would get Republicans to vote for them. That was stupid as fuck. It didn’t work.
I voted for Harris.
Stop. Just stop. Quit blaming people and get ready for what’s coming. Organize a defense. Your life depends more on what you do now, than who voted for what.
This is awesome. You just absolutely nailed the exact cause. Now all we have to do is what? Eliminate the voters? That sounds like the Republican plan to me.
Or maybe your plan is to convince the voters to do otherwise? Don’t you think the politicians have a tiny little bit of responsibility in that area?
Neoliberalism leads to fascism via a well understood pattern that’s currently repeating all around the globe. If you want better voters, then you need better Democrats.
You aren’t looking for solutions, you’re looking for someone to blame. Quit bitching and start working towards something better, or you’re as useless as the Democratic establishment.
Quit bitching and start working towards something better, or you’re as useless as the Democratic establishment.
That’s the thing. Centrists believe that there is nothing wrong with Democratic establishment, and that they were failed by the stupid voters they hate.
Yeah, because DNC didn’t do a spectacularly bad job of fucking up the campaign.
May the people in this sub who screeched Genocide Joe and threatened Kamala over her continued support for Israel get the policies they voted for.
But at least they got join MAGA to own the libs.
We told you it was a losing issue. You called us Russian bots and tankies and trumpists because that was easier than listening to something you didn’t want to hear.
I voted for Harris. But that doesn’t mean I’m blind to the suicidal boneheadedness of the pro-genocide centrist wing of the Democratic Party. We tried to warn you. You thought you knew better. In your overwhelming and unearned arrogance, you concluded that anyone that was willing to read the writing on the wall couldn’t possibly be an actual person with agency.
Now go hug Dick Cheney. He’s the only vote any of you cared about.
If the anti-genocide left were too insignificant to treat like humans, they’re too insignificant to blame. Centrists ran the campaign they wanted. Their instincts were and remain shit.
I really hope we get the policies of Cornel West. That would be totally awesome. It’s why I voted for dude.
Instead we’re getting a continuation of Genocide Joe.
Next time just vote Trump, save yourself the extra steps.
Yep, you are getting what you voted for…
I believe Putin’s power over Trump will prevent anyone doing anything extreme about Iran. Russia has always had an interest in controlling Iran and certainly would not approve the US taking it out.
I think that Netanyahu has more power than Putin at this point.
When he got re-elected after all the shit he did I knew it was not gonna end well. When Trump backed him hard during his presidency I knew it was gonna be bad. The left voters stepping aside to allow what’s coming is just insane
It’s time to do something about it. Not just piss and moan.
I mean, I’m all for doing both:
We should get ready for resistance, WHILE, kicking the fuck out of all the fake idiot ‘lefties’ who helped this happen.
I would bet my left nut that Bibi has ALL the Kompromat on Trump that Pootin has, along with a metric shit ton of his own.
And these fuckin morons will still say there was no wars under Trump
It does feel about on-brand for this timeline that Trump of all leaders might get the credit for fixing* the Middle East problem.
- where the problem is the existence of the conflict, and the solution of a glassy wasteland littered with charred skeletons will successfully not have regional conflicts for a thousand years.
He criticized Trump’s approach to foreign policy, suggesting Trump would be inclined to “capitulate” to authoritarian leaders, which may not sit well with some Republicans.
Don’t they even know who they picked to represent them?
“ex official said: this might happen and that might mean” how is this relevant news?
Iran did try and assassinate him, I wouldn’t be surprised if he holds a grudge for that.
So the same thing as Biden?
The war with Iran is already on the doorstep of happening under Bidens unconditional aid.
Such a shame Kamala did not get elected. Who also promised unconditional aid and advocated for starting a war with Iran.
Posts like this would have a lot more impact if the Democrats were different.
Do agree, these people seems to ignore the news or at least now aware of what is happening.
If Biden didn’t want a war with Iran they would have stopped the genocide in Gaza, pushed for an actual deal, remember the one that Hamas agreed to and then Israel backtracked. He could have stopped the bombing of the Iranian embassy in Syria, or the attack on Lebanon.
Iran telling the whole world about there drone attack and then Israel goes to attack Iran again, followed directly with USA and UK telling Iran to stop it aggression??
Iran have population of 90 million people, Israel has 7 maybe, pretending Iran cannot take Israel is just stupid.
No Kamala would‘ve saved us! /s
Somehow the same people who thought they could make the argument of “neither party will stop what is happening in Gaza, so vote based on other issues” don’t think israel already had a blank check. Now these same people are gloating as if the people of Gaza deserve to be genocided because the democrats didn’t win. It’s sick and it’s illustrative of what’s wrong with the “democratic” party.
I loathe the comments saying some version of “I hope everyone who didn’t vote for Harris gets what they deserve”. Dem bullying and refusal to stop 100% support of war crimes (including domestic protest suppression/condemnation) alienated a crucial part of their base, but apparently it’s still not their fault. Now there’s bitter folks here taking a sick satisfaction telling people they’re going to suffer and consoling themselves by viciously insulting everyone who didn’t fall in line.
Apparently when the horrors happen it’s not because Harris ran a shit campaign courting conservatives, didn’t listen, and promised more of the same (or even a slide right) as Biden, a president with an approval rating in the 30-40% range. It’s not because she refused to promise an immediate stop to support of war crimes as per America’s own laws. It’s the fault of everyone who refused to vote against their conscience because a “lesser evil” platform didn’t convince them to support a party of unrepentant war criminals.
Downvote me all you want and tell me how idiotic I am. I told people urgently to vote Harris right up until the election, but I also always spoke out against bullying on Lemmy and it’s only gotten worse post-election. The people in this thread talking about how others are going to get what they deserve are abusive people and I don’t want to be associated with them anyways. Their disapproval is something I’m proud of.
America first
Which is totally nothing like the blank check they currently are getting.
Israel will lose that war.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
I don’t think you understand the capabilities difference - Israel has the nuclear option if they are threatened existentially. But lets take that off the table a moment.
Iran’s capabilities are their missiles, manufacturing capabilities. Their Refineries, and strategic energy reserves are in known locations and are the lynch pin of Iran’s economy. And finally, the Nuclear R&D facilities are in known places. All of those are the targets - and Israel absolutely has the capacity to take it out- just not the strong justification.
If Iran continues striking Israel, Israel is going to feel the pressure to decapitate Iran as a threat to them.
The fall out of this is more interesting:
-
China loses access to Iranian Oil for the short to mid term - it will take time to restore capabilities.
-
Russia loses access to Iranian missiles - without production capabilities, and depleted stocks, Iran will not be able to sell missiles to Russia let alone drones.
-
Iran’s economy will be in shambles - that could very well open the door to coup or revolt.
-
Iran would unload as many missiles as it possibly could - which could be devastating. But that would come down to just how many interceptor missiles Israel would have available, along with other air defence options.
If you want a “Why would trump support this” - there you have it. It reaffirms US obligation to support it’s allies, It puts economic pressure on china, and denies Russia access to weapons - which should help push them to the negotiating table.
In reality, I would more expect Iran to back off. Then again - With Israel obliterating Iran proxies, Iran may feel the pressure to complete a nuclear deterrent and Israel may end up wanting to decapitate Iran as a threat BEFORE they gain that capability… what a bloody mess.
I dont dissagree. But for the rest of yall here, the point stands.
Foreign policy is nuanced, multi layered, and gives no shits about your morality. Any of you that boil down the issue to palistine vs israel or race or religion, have no idea whats going on. Two state solutions are just to placate you while wholesale slaughter happens.
This is about power and maintaining it. Always has been. And american, or western dominance in the region as a way to maintain what little peace exists, and not let our adversaries seize that control, is the end sum game.
Im not saying its right. But superpowers and governments do not care about your moral hangups. A hundred thousand dead “someone else” vs a major strategic location means nothing. Appalling, sure, but there is a brutal logic to it.
That’s all under the assumption that Iran didn’t secretly develop nukes, or bought them from Russia or North Korea and just keeps it completely hidden to turn the tides at the last possible second.
Lets, for a moment, presume Iran has Nuclear weapons - and uses them. Lets just remind that Israel is known to have at LEAST 90 nuclear warheads, and several of those missiles are likely prepped ready pointed at Iran.
To put it simply: That move DOES NOT end well. If anything, it ends strictly worse then simply accepting that Israel crippled Iran’s infrastructure. And any hope for normalization and opening trade up on the global market outside of China, Russia, and North Korea becomes basically zero until the regime is overthrown. Even worse - if Israel opts for nuclear strikes to follow up their conventional ones after being attacked with nuclear weapons,there is a good chance it’s not just several years of repair work, but decades of set back that could easily lead to mass scale discontentment and open revolt against the regime by several factions simultaneously.
The reality is: Israel is not a force capable of sustained occupation of an entity like Iran. But they are a force capable of a decapitating strike. And the entire reason is, Israel has VERY LIMITED force projection capabilities - and, because of a lack of land boarder with Iran, would need cooperation with other states that may not be thrilled with opening themselves up to direct conflict in the short to mid term. The only real reason Israel has room to do a strike is 1. It’s retaliatory, and 2. entities like Saudi Arabia are liable to be just fine with their regional rivals basically offing each other, as Saudi Arabia is in a MUCH better position to take advantage in the event of Iran’s regime collapsing.
Which brings us to: Just because you have nuclear weapons, does not mean you use them. The reality is, nuclear weapons are a weapon of last resort - unless you are France, and then it’s a nuclear warning shot… Because France is just different.
Trump wont go against Putin lol
-
HOW?!?!
You do realize, the only way to get from Iran to Israel, is via air.
The Iranian air force has checks notes some old mig-21s, 25s, F-4s and F-14s that don’t fly.
The Israeli Air Force has checks notes F-15s (undefeated in air combat) and F-35s (ditto).
It wouldn’t be a fight, it would be one of those scenes in movies where the guy is tied up and beaten for information, till the guy punching just gets tired of swinging and takes a quick break.
