People need to realize you can use alternatives
tbf people just wanna sign up and click on funny links, not browse through 100 rando instances to find the one that lines up with their exact interests and wait for approval and worry about uptime and whether their instance will still exist in a year
I feel that, while lemmy is still a work in progress, it is already pretty adequate for solving this need. If you want to subscribe to other instances you can do it from within your insance by going up to communities and searching. You can also click the all tab and see a bunch of instances from around lemmy that your instance is federated with.
I think mastadon struggled with this because the twitter model is to follow people and depending how far removed the servers are this can be trickier. Compared to lemmy where people interested in a single subject will likely target and find the subject theyre interested in and bring themselves together naturally.
Furthermore I think some people are splitting up and dividing into sub instances and tiny subjects a little prematurely. Reddit didnt get super esoteric with it’s subs until it got big and the larger subs either declined or got too noisy to talk about certain things. Like for example how beehaw has an operatingsystems instance instead of a linux, ubuntu, macos, windows, fedora, archinux, opensuse, openbsd, etc. Right now there arent enough of us that we dont need to subdivide.
I’ve seen people literally signing up here just to make like 50 empty communities and not post or comment on anything at all. Definitely a lot of folks just trying to stake some territory that they think will be valuable in the future.
Im sure some of it is staking out territory, but I think a good chunk of it is just that modern reddit mindset. The mindset is that of course you cant have good gaming discussion on gaming you need to have truegaming, and games, and linux_gaming, and patientgamers, and etc. The thing is you can and things are small enough on all instances even lemmy.ml and beehaw that you can talk about it in one place.
The reason reddit had so many is that it would rapidly homogenise into giant echo chambers with minimal community. Minority perspectives were supressed or drowned out by lurker voting.
New subs were being made to recapture giant subs’ original intentions, or specialise, yo put minority perspectives of the Hot page and curate a community as a result.
Lemmy isn’t big enough to homogenise like that, at least not yet.
Good thing this is pretty pointless, since I can have the same community name in another instance.
I’m pretty confident we’ll eventually see some form of voluntary synchronization between identical communities added to either the codebase or a popular client app. “Owning” an individual instance’s community will be worthless.
(Wish I had the !remindme bot right now)
I like how Beehaw is doing it. Slowly introducing new servers as there is demand for it.
I also like the beehaw has a mission for community in mind, supported by having an application process; and their having prepared umbrella communities that will prevent echo chambers.
Beehaw is definitely getting hammered too though; it’s probably the second- or third-largest instance atm.
Beehaw is most definitely an echo chamber.
Very true. It would be sad to build up a persona on a smaller instance to then have it go dark and take your user with it. Other than losing your collection of “upvotes,” you can just recreate a new user with the same display name on another instance and keep going. 👍
Holy crap, you can do Slack style emoticons? Huzzah! 🎉
Let me see if I underatand this correctly:
If I create an account on a random, small instance. And then go to the “all communities” feed. I can automatically see all communities that are in my instance. In addition to that, I can see all communities of other Lemmy instances, that are “federated”. But I cannot see other communities from other nstances, unless I go on there, find the communitis and manually subscribe to them (I believe there are other ways to get them to show up, like using the search etc.?)
So, as a normal user. Who’s just looking for a replacement for /r/all, wouldn’t joining the largest lemmy instance that is fedarated to many others (Just by how many users it has, because it’s the users who link instances by their actions?) make perfect sense?
The all communities tab should be showing you communities from every instance you are federated with. It’s true that they won’t show up in your feed until someone on your instance connects to the instance it’s on at least once, but you don’t need to be on a massive server to be connected to all the major communities right from the start.
This. There’s no need to join the biggest instance, as long as you’re not among an instance’s first users you won’t notice much difference.
Idk I kind of think it having a bit more complexity might help ward off enshitification
I use lemmy.world. they have an associated mastodon as well.
Same here, except I have no interest in Mastodon.
I definitely didnt pick sh.itjust.works for the funny name, naaaaaaaaah
I created my own server…
This is the way. If you don’t like the moderators, don’t play on their servers. It’s that simple.
Me too. Gonna close registrations at about 100 users. I don’t want this to get expensive but I’ll contribute what I can
Based on my previous experience running a Mastodon server, 90%+ of people are going to concentrate on already popular servers, especially the “official” one. I suppose I will also close (or be strict about) registration at some point myself, but I have a feeling I am not going to have to worry about it for a long time. My goal now is just to get some friends and acquaintances to join any lemmy instance, bonus points if it is mine.
I’ve just started my journey into lemmy, but I have to say, the federation part definitely needs better tooling. Like exploring beyond the borders of my instance is (at least using Jerboa) relatively hard. It feels very much like distinct universes, and less like a single space (like Reddit).
Well, since I am one of the people who chose the “official” server on Lemmy as well as on Mastodon, I will tell you why I did it: The “official” server will most likely be the one, that has the least chance to be abandoned/closed at some time in contrast to a small server maintained by some student as a side-project (no offense :-) ). I don’t want to loose everything and start at zero, so I chose the most “reliable” server.
Yeah the people that say “what instance you join doesn’t really matter aside from your local page” when it does. It might be easier to get into an instance with only one other person, but that doesn’t mean that instance will continue to exist a year from now or even tomorrow.
I absolutely understand. I used to run a Mastodon server, and stopped when it no longer interested me. I never really used twitter anyway whereas I am on reddit most every day, so I am expecting this to hold my interest/attention longer. I run a number of services for myself already (git, password manager, media hosting, authentication, etc) so the burden of one more thing in my homelab is minimal vs someone who isn’t doing that sort of thing.
Overall, some manner of truly federated and distributed user identity is something the current fediverse seems to be lacking. Nobody has really adopted DID yet and most of its registries still rely on some sort of central authority for identity regardless.
There’s a big difference between hosting single user servers vs public servers though. If it’s just for you then you can do whatever you want with it and it can be a lot of fun (until something breaks that is)
Same here. I only have a couple of users though so I don’t show up on join-lemmy.org anymore. Not sure how to gather more users now. I figure if I do actually get up to a hundred or so users I’ll set up a LibrePay account and expand based on available funds.
New feddit.de user reporting in
Ze Germans seem to have their own monopolistic instance
The documentation explaining how fediverse works is so bad. It’s so long and convoluted anyone new just can’t be bothered reading it.
Yeah. It needs to be explained much better. Compare it to email or something
Docu-what now?
Seriously, if the average user needs to understand distributed systems to play in the fediverse pool, they are going to land back at Reddit. Just get people in the door (any door) and fight the technical debt that creates later.
Sure, it’s a shit plan. But, it’s the only way to really capitalise on the current moment. With both Twitter and Reddit blasting away at their own feet, there is a real opportunity for something better to step up. The fediverse can be that thing. But, not if people end up gatekeeping it. Less Stallman style, “RTFM!” And more, “hey, welcome. Let’s get you set up.”
Idk what’s going on, I just know I’m ready for open source options. I’m signed up here and mastodon now and plan to use the duration of the reddit strike to learn more about these platforms, delete my activity on others, and slowly build communities so I’m not reliant on others for news and learning.
I don’t think it’s too difficult to figure out. Seems more like a matter of shifting activity to keep people engaged. I’m far from tech literate, though.
Well, that’s my point. We need a cheat sheet easy to read that gives most of the necessary information to create an account and use different instances and how to post from one to another.
https://join-lemmy.org/docs/en/index.html is good but way too much for newcomers
I agree, the first page is already too much text, where is the easy to consume infographic explaining it in comic style? :/
It doesn’t help that there are pictures, but they’re failing to load atm.
bro’ i didn’t even knew that there was a documentation
https://join-lemmy.org/docs/en/index.html
No, one will read that
We need a way simpler cheat sheet to get people in and leave that documentation for later
Someone posted a good infographic about the fediverse over on kbin in RedditMigration (another complicated wrinkle in this whole fediverse thing) that did a great job explaining this whole fediverse thing.
If only I could link it.
Edit: jerboa editor doing me dirty
I recognize it’s easier said than done obviously and I don’t have a good solution to propose; but if there was a way to make the app UI more user friendly it might help the understandability of the fediverse and subsequently lower the barrier to entry. Unless someone can figure out how to make it more seemless of an experience, it’s gonna be hard to get massive traction
Lemmy.world checking in
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The thing that is the most annoying about the same username on different servers is that most of the time only the username part is shown (for example on feeds and comments). So a troll could make accounts with the same username on a different instance and discredit the original comment. For example, you are @kadu@lemmy.world, I could create @kadu@lemmy.ml and say stuff here, and both of us would just show up as “kadu” and to others it might seem that we are the same account without going into our profile to see our full “address”.
You could always create an account for your username on multiple popular servers if you wanted to. Can’t stop it on small servers but having multiple accounts in the Fediverse is not a crime.
Nah, I can’t see any reason to make more than one account.
yeah
It can be useful in case whatever instance you’re using defederate or is defederated by another instance you want to participate in. It’s also useful in case your instance goes the way of the dodo and shut down.
Look at the usernames in the replies to this comment
yeah
agreed
Why would you need more than one?
Just if you wanted more than one. Just like u/kadu said about email. It’s like if you had your email on Google, Yahoo, and Hotmail. I know a lot of people have an alt on platforms like Discord too.
I know, look at the usernames of the replies
I hate Discord with a passion. Can’t wait for https://github.com/vector-im/element-call to be done so I can leave that behind.
same
same
Wow, posting on some of the bigger instances was really slow. I guess the influx of users has caused that
Lemmy world was the only one that let me sign up lol
aussie.zone alive and kicking.
First I created account there and then landed on my current instance, because lemmy.ml’s admin views looks sketchy for me. Been living in ex-ussr for all my life I just cant accept all that communists and marxists and the fact that lemmy.ml has /c/Communism on it.
I know that’s silly but that’s why I’m not there anymore.
Profit motive ruined Reddit so you’ve come to a place created by communist then get upset that the people who made and operate it are communists. Yeah that’s more than a little silly.
There’s a difference between being a communist and blindly supporting authoritarian dictatorships wearing communist masks.
I’ve not really looked into it too deeply because every single mile-long screed about this “controversy” starts off by clutching pearls about communists. Can you link me to where this is happening without paragraphs of dissembling preamble?
This is the lead dev on Russia’s invasion, total support here and other comments:
A few months later, they’ve apparently flipped on the issue entirely and now support US aid:
I’m not very concerned with the “communist” or tankie part fwiw. And while I do have strong opinions on Russia’s invasion, I’m far more concerned with the 180 shift in position displayed here, and I have yet to find an explanation. I don’t think he wants to talk about it, but a quick “I changed my mind because xyz” could alleviate my concerns. Clear communication is important if you’re gonna have such strong opinions imo.
I’m not trying to villainize him or cancel lemmy, he seems like a decent person and we’ve even had a brief interaction here… But I hope you can see why I’m cautious about things. The whiplash is my main issue, not which side he picks.
And I’m not here to stir the pot, it’s just that you specifically asked and I had already personally looked into things.
Mods: I won’t be spamming this, just wanted to put it out there once.
However… if the platform prospers and attracts enough other devs, none of this even remotely matters, and that’s why I’m still here, I want to believe this can be set aside.
Oh no ;_;
Any recommended communities? (or ones to avoid)
Everything from beehaw.org is nice. Even stuff on lemmy.ml is okay as long you don’t bring up politics. Stay away from news or politics subs on this instance. And I hope we will get bigger communities on other servers than lemmy.ml or beehaw.org.
All I know is that you should avoid lemmy.ml. In their /c/WorldNews community, an admin gave a four day ban to a user for posting an Axios article about the Chinese succession plan for the reason of “Orientalism”. Those guys are tankie shills. In my experience, lemmy.ca, sh.itjust.works, and lemmy.one seem solid. Obviously I personally went with lemmy.ca. But you should check out the admin profiles before you join any instance. That will tell you most of what you need to know. That and the modlogs (found at the bottom of the page) that will tell you what posts have been taken down and what people have been banned by mods on various communities.
Who are they shilling for?
I recognize you, you’re an old head around these parts, you were there during my battle with that one CHEF_KOCH fuckface, I like you.
That said, you’ve been here at least as long as I have, semantics regarding the word “shill” aside you know this place is (kinda was) a majority State Communist, or “Tankie,” echo chamber, and they pushed it relentlessly. It’s why you only ever saw me in c/linux, I don’t like political evangelism to the degree it used to be found here. C’mon lol.
majority State Communist,
Is there any reason you don’t say Marxist?
Because as I understand it Marxism is a stateless society, but most of the people here were supporting State Communism, so not Marxism.
I would strongly recommend researching . Marxism before declaring self-proclaimed Marxists to not be Marxists.
Now do “State Communism”
China and Russia. Thus censoring legitimate western media articles about China. There’s also a lot of anti-NATO bullshit. Here’s the Axios article they banned a user for posting.
legitimate western media articles
anti-NATO bullshit
Out of idle curiosity, do you self-identify as a leftist?
I generally align with the left most of the time, but I hate making one label the basis for your entire political opinion. I am very against censorship. My greatest pet issues have to do with censorship and democratic principles. In terms of American politics, I will never vote Republican. If I feel a Democrat has let me down in a big way, I would consider voting third party, but 99% of the time I would vote Democratic. Centrist Democrats piss me off more than leftist ones. My foreign policy stances are probably the least in line with the further left. I am generally pro-NATO with the understanding that NATO isn’t perfect. I just worry way more about a world with China/Russia at the helm given their propensity for censoring opinions that oppose their majority parties.
I am generally pro-NATO with the understanding that NATO isn’t perfect.
I’m terminally-online enough that I am used to the paths of most arguments that have appeared on this website about politics, but – and I say this to be transparent – this one baffles me and I don’t know how to respond to it. I’ve seen people say it but, well, it gets hard to explain within rule 1.
Maybe if we agree that “NATO is an extension of US foreign policy” we can sidestep the issue for now.
I just worry way more about a world with China/Russia at the helm given their propensity for censoring opinions that oppose their majority parties.
This one I am much more used to. Remembering that NATO is a military organization and not, you know, “who controls the internet,” I’d like to just present you with a simple pair of questions:
-
How many of the past thirty years has the US been at war?
-
How many of the past thirty years has China been at war?
Beyond that, for all the fearmongering people do, China is remarkably less interested in unilaterally dictating relations than you might think, so explaining things in terms of “which country is the master of the unipolar world order” is not justified. Unipolarity has only been the state of things for a little over 30 years (and only obvious for a little over 40) and was unheard of before that. There is no reason to suppose that the future can only be unipolar, especially if the country that ushered in unipolarity and viciously guards it with world-historic levels of violence (the US) is no longer the strongest force.
China has shown every indication of seeking bilateral development and cooperation. An example in severe microcosm is the US banning China from the International Space Station and China responding by making its own space station which the US isn’t banned from, nor most other countries (though I think it is still a finite list and not totally open, owing in part to being a new program). Stories like “debt traps” from China are grotesque projection, as China doesn’t do things like forced restructuring or asset seizure, unlike the IMF.
I truly think this sort of “US is the least of the available evils” ideology has a hard time existing except in a subcultural bubble where it meets no challenge at all, because it is an astoundingly flimsy position.
-
I’m currently on lemmy.world. You can create communities and people are chill over here.
Is it possible to move instances once I’m registered or do I have to create totally new account on other instance?
You’d need to sign up for a totally new account. There is talk of adding a migration feature but obviously that’ll require a bit of patience, they’ve got a long list of feature requests!
Unfortunately an account transfer feature is pretty complicated to develop so it might still be a while. Devs need to make sure it doesn’t cause issues with federation when content changes home instances and domains, and transferring live user content over while retaining points, interactions by other accounts, and while having the same timestamp but now being hosted on a different instance, while ensuring there is only one canonical location/URL of the content on the fediverse, is not easy.
It’s not silly at all. I also made an account there before realizing the admins are tankies. It honestly sketches me out about Lemmy in general considering they’re the two lead (and currently only?) devs. Casts a big shadow over all of Lemmy when the devs are posting Xinjiang genocide denialism and their instance is at the top of the recommendations on join-lemmy.org. With lemmy.grad pretty high up there too.
Yeah that’s what Lemmy started out as. The thing is with all the Reddit refugees flooding in it is diluting out the tankies. Besides, lemmygrad.ml is blocked by many instances. As for the values of the devs the great thing is that Lemmy is FOSS so if they go rouge someone will just make a fork of Lemmy.
At least with the way Lemmy is designed it doesn’t seem like even the main devs can have much of an impact.
They even write themselves that if they made changes to the Lemmy codebase that some instance admins didn’t like, then those admins can decide not to upgrade their instance. The code is also open sourced so anyone with some tech know-how can fork the codebase and remove whatever they don’t like.
Are you familiar with the Nayirah Testimony?
As someone who intentionally joined a different instance, the biggest issue is the “federation” doesn’t allow cross-authentication. Clicking a link to another instance moves me to that instance where I’m not logged in. Authentication should really be cross-instance.
I agree with you
This is something I also find strange. If I click a link to an instance, I want to view their content and not visit their homepage, where I am not logged in and cannot do anything.
assuming the servers are properly federated you should be getting a link that is still on your server. i mean, you got to this lemmy.ml link alright at least
wait, i think i get what you mean, like if you get an external link while not browsing on your instance? you should just be able to paste that link into the search function to find your instance’s version of the post
Yeah, I can manually search and find communities, but hyperlinks move you to the other instance (on a webpage; browsing within an app like mlem seems to work)
links that you find while browsing on reddthat.com will send you to other instances? that’s super odd, I’m not getting that behavior with midwest.social or lemmy.ml, using mobile or desktop firefox. just pasting the links into the search to find your instance’s version of the post is a bit of a janky workaround but it should work. you might try posting in https://reddthat.com/c/lemmy_support@lemmy.ml
If I click the link you provided, my browser takes me to Lenny.ml. There I am not logged in and my credentials from feddit.de are not working. So I cannot post there.
I think it only works if the link points to a community on another instance. Like !memes@lemmy.ml . Maybe this is the intended behavior.
The downside is, you can not visit an instance and view the local communities and their post and interact with them. This makes it a lot more attractive to join the instance where the communities are you want to frequent.
Edit: the link to the community does not work either for me. But I am kind of sure, that there are links that work as intended and make you just view the community from your own insurance…
You can subscribe to those communities on your instance, and then interact with them.
From my instance, I’ve been crossing to other instances fine to post, upvote, etc.
I think this occurs because people haven’t gotten used to linking to communities on other instances properly.
They usually post the direct link like beehaw.org/c/technology . Instead they should start using the federated link which is more instance agnostic like this: /c/technology@beehaw.org . This link will load the community from your instance.
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FWIW, on a browser the /c/technology link you posted isn’t a hyperlink, so I can’t actually interact with it. It doesn’t work in mlem either.
Yeah. A shorter-term solution might be a browser plugin that recognizes links like that and converts it to a hyperlink to that community on whatever instance you tell it. I’m not a programmer but that does seem like a relatively simple plugin for somebody that actually knows what they’re doing.
Can you elaborate on your experience a bit more? I can’t say I have had any issues as you’ve described. If something doesn’t look right, or isn’t working the way you expect, it might actually be a bug.
I chose lemmy.ml based on two things:
- I wanted a server that wasn’t likely to close I don’t really know for sure, but I imagine it’s easy to underestimate how much money or time is required to run a server. And I’d really prefer not having to worry about migrating. The ‘run by Lemmy’s developers’ part makes me think that either the risk will be lower or the people running the server will know how to prevent reaching a point like that.
- I didn’t want to join a very specific instance As I see it, there are two possible scenarios:
- The instance I join will affect the content I’m exposed (and not exposed) to, in which case I want to experience ‘the whole internet’ rather than a section of it.
- The instance I choose is irrelevant to the content I get, in which case, (apart from community rules) it shouldn’t really matter which one I choose, so I would just join the biggest instance.
Still something that could help with the choosing-an-instance process is to display in the list of servers the community rules and if they are blocking certain communities.
“I just want to be where the people are” 🧜♀️
I’m just glad to already see Seinfeld fans here.
Same… why would I use a smaller instance when the bigger one has more stuff on it? Maybe I just don’t understand this instance thing properly, it all just feels so fragmented
Same… why would I use a smaller instance when the bigger one has more stuff on it? Maybe I just don’t understand this instance thing properly, it all just feels so fragmented
You don’t NEED to be on the big instance in order to participate on the big instance.
That’s the true beauty of what we’re doing here.
Is there ever a reason to have multiple accounts in the fediverse?
One instance might have separate rules than another, so you can use multiple to get around that. Also if one instance gets shutdown for whatever reason you’ll need another instance to browse through.
Generally though, no. One instance is fine and helps keep the system from getting overloaded with users.
Like so many other people here. The federation concept is completely new to them and over time people will settle down and get used to how it works. Maybe people will set up their own instances for the ultimate name swag.
I did
Imagine an Instance as an email address. You can still access any content from any instance (mostly). All posts and comments just go through your instance for you to see them
You can even see it looking at the usernames of people in different instances. For example, I see your username as @Silviecat44@vlemmy.net, which pretty much identically follows the format of an email address.
lemmy.world unite!
I too have landed on lemmy world. Seems nice here. I’ve noticed a lot of timing out over on lemmy.ml lately, seems they’re getting dogpiled lol
Just registered. Very excited for this new adventure.
Same! Can’t wait to see what happens.
