• clearleaf@lemmy.world
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    1 year ago

    A lot of people think social credit scores are something society can’t function without, but they only started in 1989.

    • 8bitguy@kbin.social
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      1 year ago

      I certainly have problems with the way current financial institutions operate, but prior to the credit score there wasn’t a standardized, scientific way to assess lending risk. It was left to a good ol’ boy process rife with racism, classism, and sexism. Sadly, we’re better off with what we have now, as flawed as it is.

        • shalafi@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          It was so much better before! When being a woman, or god forbid, being black, counted as serious criteria. Oh, and you best be friends with the banker. (Read the part, again, about being a white man, who was well accepted in the community.)

          It’s not a scam, it’s a step forward. Time to take the next step.

            • Ashyr@sh.itjust.works
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              1 year ago

              Because there are standard metrics for where the score comes from. Each of the big three has slightly different weighting, but it all broadly comes out the same.

              The numbers aren’t made up. You can look at your credit report and see what is affecting it.

              • RaoulDook@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                Yep it’s not a mystery at all if you care enough to read about it. All these “capitalist dystopia” complainers sound like what I probably thought about credit scores when I was in my early 20s and had terrible credit from being irresponsible with credit cards. My credit score is 800 now because I simply pay my bills on time and have an established history of doing so.

                • Ashyr@sh.itjust.works
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                  1 year ago

                  Yeah, it’s not a perfect system and I would welcome increased federal oversight and greater transparency because it does have the potential for abuse.

                  That said, it’s not numbers made up to keep the little guy down. Lenders want to lend money because they make money off it. The whole point is to determine whether or not you’re a safe investment.

                  We could have a discussion on the merits of modern usury, which can be deeply predatory and abusive. It’s not the credit score that’s the problem.

              • PunnyName@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                The numbers are made up, unless you can actually prove your original statement.

                Edit: oh, and since proving a negative is essentially impossible, you can’t actually prove your original statement, so I would recommend not making statements like that, and try to rephrase.

              • Earthwormjim91@lemmy.world
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                1 year ago

                You think the people that scream about credit scores have ever looked at and analyzed their credit report lol

                  • Earthwormjim91@lemmy.world
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                    1 year ago

                    Literally nobody is making you apply for lines of credit outside your income levels… that’s entirely on you.

                    There’s no game to play. You take out credit, you pay it back. You have revolving credit, you pay the balance every month and don’t carry debt. It’s literally that simple.

                    I have never had to apply for an increase in credit limits, pay your bills and banks/credit card companies will just do it automatically.

                    It’s really not hard in the least.

          • Lols [they/them]@lemm.ee
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            1 year ago

            i dont see the problem with improving your credit score by sacrificing a virgin to the volcano every year, at least anyone can do it instead of just the well accepted white men

            im being unfair of course, unlike modern credit scores tossing a virgin into the volcano doesnt still put minorities at a disadvantage

        • EatATaco@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          which should be the only allowable metric.

          Why? Income is a terrible metric. Regardless of how much money I’ve made, I’ve always spent within my means. I’ve never carried debt, but always has my cc to build the credit score.

          The idea that some bozo who spends more than he earns has a better credit score than me just because he makes more money makes absolutely zero sense to me.

            • EatATaco@lemm.ee
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              1 year ago

              I never said it wasn’t a factor, only a terrible one that shouldnt be the only one. Also try improving your credit score and see the better rates and cards with better benefits open up to you.

              And what the fuck is wrong with you that you even think about someone else’s credit score?

              Considering you think I spend time thinking about people’s credit score because I think it’s better metric for getting credit, this question is all but a straight up admission that you spend a lot of mental energy thinking about the income of other people.

              Are you mad that your neighbor is straight too?

        • 8bitguy@kbin.social
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          1 year ago

          What about those that have sufficient income, but don’t pay their bills and have defaulted on previous loans?

      • Throwaway@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        If it was a publicly available algorithim, then Id believe you. But it ain’t, so I’m suspicious.

        • EatATaco@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          We don’t know the algorithms specifically, but we have enough information to have a pretty good idea how it works.

        • shalafi@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          It’s better than what it was. High time to take another look, but it’s far, far better.

      • db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        1 year ago

        It seems to me it doesn’t count risk. It counts profitability. It’s why it drops when people pay their loans early.

      • MonkderZweite@feddit.ch
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        1 year ago

        there wasn’t a standardized, scientific way to assess lending risk.

        Neither is it now. You forgot the ‘hidden from public’ part.

        • Dkarma@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          They tell u what affects your score right on the credit report! Hahaha What the fuck are u clowns talking about.

      • slipperydippery@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        Why would you be better off? In the rest of the world you just have to provide proof of income and proof of savings and debt and banks can calculate how much they are willing to loan you for the purchase of a house. Seems to work fine, and I don’t have to have pay interest on meaningless loans just to prove that I can.

        • PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee
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          1 year ago

          The problem is that just having the income and savings doesn’t necessarily guarantee that you’ll be as good about paying back a loan as someone of your same income and savings.

          That’s supposed to be where the credit score helps, but the current system is so shady that it basically just reads as the ol’ boys club system but asking pretty please to pretend there’s a formula and method being used.

          • slipperydippery@lemmy.world
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            1 year ago

            I think there are plenty of failsafe mechanisms. But most importantly, if you fail to pay your mortgage, the bank has the right to take possession of your house. Those forces the bank to do it’s due diligence with regards to the value of the house. Also, if a bank has been too lenient with its mortgages, it can get into serious trouble - the government here enforces pretty strict rules to prevent people from getting in over their heads.

      • beatensoup@baraza.africa
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        1 year ago

        If you don’t take credit facilities but pay for your expenses in cash, you are considered a risk. Credit scoring based on credit card purchases is akin to being required to be spied on every step of the way just so you can access what you practically can without the credit in the first place. I don’t have a problem with people who are fine with that kind of behavior. But there should be a way of fair assessment even if you pay in cash.

      • clearleaf@lemmy.world
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        1 year ago

        It’s funny how the other person who replied to me said credit scores are actually the solution to racism. I think you’re the one who’s right it’s just funny. I’d like to take this opportunity to say it’s retarded that you can pay rent for years but not be approved for a mortgage with equal or lesser payments.

        • shalafi@lemmy.world
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          1 year ago

          Nobody said credit scores were the solution. They were merely a step forward.

          Young liberals: “It’s not good enough or fast enough! NOW!!!”

          I’ll take what I can get, even if it takes some time.

      • PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee
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        1 year ago

        You’re showing way too much faith in the institutions that invented the red lining in the first place to imply that the ol’ boys club system wasn’t waaaaay more rife with systemic racism.

        The post war recovery laws were literally lobbied to specifically exclude black folks, but sure, home buying was easier for them then than it was post credit scores.

          • PhlubbaDubba@lemm.ee
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            1 year ago

            It might have been “illegal” but lenders were still basically doing it anyways, just calling it everything else imaginable. Shit they still do it when they think they’ll get away with it, folks have actually tested it, real estate brokers list houses shown by white “owners” at higher values than those shown by black “owners”

      • Anyolduser@lemmynsfw.com
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        1 year ago

        This thread is full of people who don’t know what they’re talking about. I mean the whole thread is based on the implication that the credit bureaus are a government program.

    • downpunxx@kbin.social
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      1 year ago

      tell me you’re ignoring how the adult personal financial world works in the west since 1989, without you, know telling me

      • drugo@sh.itjust.works
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        1 year ago

        Most of “the west” doesn’t have that shit. But hey, maybe the USA does need credit scores and school shootings to “work”